Conversation: 656-010Prev: 656-009 Next: 656-011
Start Date: Wednesday, January 26, 1972 3:08 PM
End Date: Wednesday, January 26, 1972 5:02 PM
Participants:Nixon, Richard M. (President); Haldeman, H. R. ("Bob"); Kissinger, Henry A.; Fannin, Paul J.; White House operator; Rogers, William P.; Bull, Stephen B.; Haig, Alexander M., Jr.; Biesheuvel, Barend W.; Middendorf, J. William, II; White House photographer; [Unknown person(s)]; Lynden, Baron Rijnard B. Van;
Recording Device: Oval Office
Full Tape Conversation Start Time: 00:18:31
Full Tape Conversation End Time: 02:12:45
On January 26, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, Henry A. Kissinger, Paul J. Fannin, White House operator, William P. Rogers, Stephen B. Bull, Alexander M. Haig, Jr., Barend W. Biesheuvel, J. William Middendorf, II, White House photographer, unknown person(s), and Baron Rijnard B. Van Lynden met in the Oval Office of the White House from 10:08 am to 12:02 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 656-010 of the White House Tapes.
Nixon Library Finding Aid:
Conversation No. 656-10 Date: January 26, 1972 Time: 10:08 am - 12:02 pm Location: Oval Office The President met with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman and Henry A. Kissinger. Congressional resolution -Preparation of a letter -Kissinger’s talk with Hugh Scott and Gerald R. Ford -Scott’s and Ford’s view -The President’s talk with Ford -Scott -Benefits -Kissinger’s schedule -Ford’s and Scott’s location -Ronald L. Ziegler -Scott Kissinger briefing Proposed terms of cease-fire -Kissinger’s briefing -Political benefits -George S. McGovern’s comments concerning the President’s statement about Nguyen Van Thieu and North Vietnam -Possible revelation of North Vietnamese position -Thieu overthrow -Troop withdrawal -Documentation -As consequence of denial Kissinger left at 10:11 am. [The President talked with Paul J. Fannin between 10:11 am and 10:12 am.] [Conversation No. 656-10A] [See Conversation No. 19-93] 7 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) [End of telephone conversation] The President’s Vietnam peace proposal speech, January 25, 1972 -News coverage -Inaccuracy of reporting -Administration handling -Assigning responsibility -The President’s schedule -Recent Congressional leaders meeting -Kissinger -Kissinger briefing to staff, January 25, 1972 -Tone -Secret diplomacy -First draft of speech -Robert H. Finch’s reaction -Politics -John A. Scali -State and Defense Department -Vice President Spiro T. Agnew -Congressional leaders meeting -Staff meeting -Thieu resignation -Timing of announcement -Peace proposal -Public relations -Kissinger [The President talked with the White House operator at an unknown time between 10:12 am and 10:17 am and requested a call to William P. Rogers.] [Conversation No. 656-10B] [See Conversation No. 19-94] [End of telephone conversation] Budget meeting -Agnew -Complaints -Political future -Demeanor 8 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -Compared to John B. Connally -Approach to problems [The President talked with Rogers between 10:17 am and 10:18 am.] [Conversation No. 656-10C] [See Conversation No. 19-181] [End of telephone conversation] Agnew -Demeanor White House staff -Charles W. Colson -Scali -William L. Safire -Scali -Kissinger’s call to Scali, Rogers, Connally -The President’s schedule -Congressional leaders meeting -Agnew -Demeanor -Consultation -Staff meeting -Kissinger -Handling -Loyalty of White House staff -Meeting with Haldeman -Winston Lord -Demeanor concerning Vietnam -Troop withdrawal -Negotiations -Status -Trips -Kissinger’s comments -Progress of talks -Rogers -Alexander M. Haig, Jr. -Ellsworth F. Bunker 9 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -Creation of record -Positive outlook -Press conference -Press conference -Ziegler -Necessity The President’s Vietnam peace proposal speech -News coverage -Marvin L. Kalb -Kissinger briefing -Scali -First draft -Kissinger’s reaction -Edits -Safire -Kalb -Scali -Dan Rather -Possible letters -Demand for apology -Vietnam troop withdrawal -Timing -1972 election -Kalb -[Arnold] Eric Sevareid -Public perception -Prisoners of war [POWs] -Troops -Ceasefire -Korea -Paul N. (“Pete”) McCloskey, Jr. -F. Bradford Morse -Letter -Colson -Withdrawal from race -Conditions -Effect on credibility of Administration -McCloskey’s comment -Secret negotiations -Administration action 10 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -Right wing’s reaction -Speech ending -Effect on attention to budget message -Thrust of PR -“Keep America United” theme -Congressional leaders meeting -Negotiations -Clark MacGregor -Delivery -Lack of Vietnam speeches -Complexity of subject -Clarity -Process -Style -Atmosphere -Eye contact with camera -Campaign benefit The President’s schedule -Signing of economic report -Press interest -Need for study -Forthcoming meeting with Richard M. Scammon -Congressional leaders meeting -Press picture -Maurice H. Stans’ announcement -Peter G. Peterson -Camp David -Economic report signing -Press interest -Photographs -Quadriad meeting -Timing -Connally -Economic report -Stans -Dinner -Peterson -Press interest -Swearing-in -Earl L. Butz 11 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -Rogers C. B. Morton -Camp David -Friday schedule -Dr. Rainer Barzel -Dewitt Wallace dinner -Weekend plans -PR -Preparation for People’s Republic of China [PRC] trip -Briefing books -Rogers and Kissinger Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 10:18 am. -Kissinger’s schedule -Press briefing Bull left at an unknown time before 10:42 am. -PRC trip -PR -Camp David -Preparations -Return to Washington, DC -McGovern and McCloskey -Administration counterattack -Congressional leaders -Vietnam critics -Media support Bull entered at an unknown time after 10:18 am. -Kissinger -Briefing Bull left at an unknown time before 10:42 am. -Television messages and domestic affairs -John D. Ehrlichman -Environment -Drugs -Benefits 12 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -J. William Middendorf, II -The President’s meeting with Prime Minister of Netherlands [Barend W. Biesheuvel] -Review -Kissinger -Rogers -Attendance at meeting of the President and Biesheuvel -Haig -State Department -Rogers [The President talked with the White House operator at an unknown time between 10:18 am and 10:42 am and requested Haig.] [Conversation No. 656-10D] [See Conversation No. 19-95] [End of telephone conversation] [The President talked with Haig between 10:42 and 10:43 am.] [Conversation No. 656-10E] [See Conversation No. 19-96] [End of telephone conversation] The President’s schedule -Middendorf Kissinger entered at 10:44 am. Kissinger schedule Vietnam -North Vietnamese terms -McGovern -Thieu government -Overthrow -Secret deal 13 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -Thieu -Publication of terms -Kissinger press conference -Review of peace process -Timetable -Withdrawal -Government -Ceasefire -Eight point plan -US proposal -Terms -Unilateral withdrawal -Surrender -Deadline -Return of POWs -Overthrow of government -South Vietnamese people -US reaction -Agnew -Attitude -The President’s Vietnam peace proposal speech -Separation of military and political issues -Clarity -Demeanor -Support for the President -Kissinger’s comment to Bryce N. Harlow -Congressional meeting -Budget meeting -Possible approach to the President or Kissinger -Effects -Patrick J. Buchanan -Troop withdrawal for ceasefire and POWs or political issues -January 25, 1972 meeting -Agnew stance -Ceasefire -Effects -North Vietnamese ceasefire terms -Troop withdrawal -Administration offer -Troop withdrawal for POWs -May 31, 1971 negotiations 14 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -Political proposal -Indication of weakness -Laos and Cambodia -South Vietnam -Bombing -US aid to Thieu -North Vietnamese thinking -Michael J. Mansfield Amendment -POWs -Administration defense -Kissinger -Rogers -Agnew -Analogy to the President vis-à-vis Dwight D. Eisenhower -Football analogy -Support for US proposals -Agnew -Compared to Congress -Congress -Scott and Ford -Meeting with Kissinger in Ziegler’s office -Press conference -Ziegler -Preparation by Kissinger -Kalb -Possible interview with Kissinger The President’s forthcoming trip to the PRC Press conference -Ziegler Kissinger left at 10:57 am. -Timing -Ziegler Public support for peace proposals -Mail -Quotes from Winston-Salem; Maryland; New York; Birmingham; Philadelphia; Connecticut; Searsdale; Texas; Amherst; Columbia, South 15 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) Carolina; Arlington, Texas; Wichita; La Grange Park, Illinois -Frank L. Rizzo -William A. Rago [?] -Maureen Mullen [?] of Brooklyn -Religious and minority groups -Judge William Garbose of Massachusetts -Mrs. Joseph Patrick Kennedy of Winnipeg -Generation of peace, Adelphi [?], Illinois Bull entered at an unknown time after 10:57 am. Biesheuvel meeting -Schedule -Protocol -Baron Rijnhard B. Van Lynden Bull left at an unknown time before 11:02 am. PRC trip -Emil (“Bus”) Mosbacher, Jr. -Herbert G. Klein -Domestic matters -Domestic Council -The President’s forthcoming trip to the Soviet Union Haldeman left at 11:02 am. Biesheuvel, Middendorf, and Haig entered at 11:02 am; the White House photographer was present at the beginning of the meeting. Introductions -Seating arrangements -Photographs Biesheuvel’s schedule -Antilles and Surinam [Photograph session] An unknown person entered at an unknown time after 11:02 am. 16 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) Refreshments The unknown person left at an unknown time before 11:20 am. Travel -Indonesia -India -Indonesia -The President’s visits Colonial legacy -Jakarta, Indonesia -Education -The president’s conversation with Lt. Gen. T.N.J. Suharto -Antilles -Retention of influence -African and Caribbean nations -Nassau, Bahamas -Soviet Union -British withdrawal -Tourism -Transition pace -Indonesia -Relations with the Netherlands -Brink of war in early 1960’s -West Iran (West New Guinea) -Suharto -Inflation -Progress -Possible visit by Biesheuvel -Dutch professionals -Suharto -Sukarno -Indonesian revolution -State visit by Queen Juliana, 1971 -Students -Suharto -US position in Pacific area -Edward R. G. Heath -Singapore -Georges J.R. Pompidou 17 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -West Germany -Relations with Japan -The Netherlands’ role in world -European community -Inter-government committee -Financial aid to Indonesia -Japan’s role in world -Vietnam, Thailand, Cambodia -Indonesia -Population -Geography -Natural resources -Java -Population -Jakarta -Indonesia The Netherlands relations with the Pacific area -Surinam and Antilles -Role -Kingdom of the Netherlands -Foreign policy and defense -United Nations [UN] -Small nations -Antilles -Geography -English-speakers -Venezuela -Aruba -Oil -Defense -Autonomy -Preparation for independence -African nations -The President’s previous trip around the world in 1953 -Thelma C. (“Pat”) Nixon -The president’s meeting with Winston Churchill in 1958 -Autonomy -Great Britain’s experience Common market -National sovereignty 18 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -Great Britain -France -Economics -International trade -Political cooperation -Use of economic power -Effects -North Atlantic Treaty Organization [NATO] Power centers -Brazil -Africa -Asia -Indonesia -US -Europe -Soviet Union -People’s Republic of China [PRC] -Japan -Coexistence with PRC, Soviet Union -Philosophical differences -Europe, Japan, US -Productivity -Compared to Communists -Monetary system, trade -Security -Japan -Economic power -Military -World War II -Reassurances by US, Europe -Treaty commitment -Nuclear deterrent -PRC, Soviet Union Europe -NATO -West Germany -Forces -Unilateral reduction -Soviet Union and Warsaw pact 19 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -Sense of belonging -West Germany -Soviet Union -East Germany -Willy Brandt -Kurt Kiesinger -Great Britain -Ostpolitik -Unity -Konrad Adenauer -Alcide de Gasperi -Robert Schumann -Biesheuvel’s experience -The Netherlands’ role -World affairs Common Market -Statement -US role -Protectionism -Economic prospects -Britain -Heath -Pompidou -Compared to previous one -Rotterdam -Perception of market -Wars -Manufacturing Attendance of ambassador -Protocol Rotterdam -Exports -Compared to New York -Common Market -Trade -West Germany Van Lynden entered at 11:25 am. 20 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) Greetings World affairs -US protectionist sentiment -US intentions -Outward look -Reaction to possible European protectionism -Japan -Europe, US, Canada, Japan cooperation -Security -Competition -Monetary matters -Group of Ten -Japan -The President’s talks with Heath, Brandt, Pompidou [?] -Group of Ten -Beliefs -Compared to western world -Economic self-interest -Political cooperation -World War II -[Emperor of Japan[ Hirohito -Visit -Contributions -PRC -Soviet Union -Productivity -World War II -Tanker purchase by Dutch -Oil companies -Dutch-Shell -US economic power -The President’s trip preparation for trips to PRC and Soviet Union -Meetings with European leaders -Italy -Italy -Government -Emilio Colombo -French constitutionalism -Latin countries 21 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -Italy, France, Spain -French Constitution -Fragmentation -France -Gen. Charles A.J.M. de Gaulle -Political unity -Communist Party -De Gasperi -Meeting with Biesheuvel -Benefits -NATO -Netherlands as an ally -Public opinion -Joseph M.A.H. Luns -Manlio Brosio The President’s forthcoming trips to the PRC and Soviet Union -Difference between trips -Enmities -US position vis-à-vis PRC and Soviet Union -Soviet Union relations with PRC -PRC -Japan -US, Soviet Union PRC trip -US intentions -Contact -Prospects of recognition -Taiwan, Republic of China -US treaty commitments -Benefits -Communication -Reduction of chance of confrontation -Korea -Vietnam -PRC nuclear power -PRC power -Population -Japan -US pacific responsibilities 22 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -Gulf in philosophies between US and PRC -Need to bridge gap -Nuclear weapons -Nuclear weapons in PRC ************************************************************************** BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 4 [National Security] [Duration: 32s ] PRC END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 4 ************************************************************************** -Prospects -Soviet reaction to PRC trip -Paranoia -Bilateralism -PRC’s relationships -Isolationism -Soviet Union -Hostile border -US -Korea -Vietnam -Japan -India -Rivalry with US, Soviet Union Defense spending -Biesheuvel’s conversation with William P. Rogers -Effect on Europe -The Netherlands -Increase in 1972 23 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -NATO -Michael J. Mansfield amendment -Alternative uses -Ghettoes Soviet Union trip -Substantive nature -US relations with Soviet Union -Relations -Difference -Trade -Middle East -Strategic Arms Limitation Talks [SALT] -Europe -Mutual and Balanced Force Reductions [MBFR] -Arms limitation -SALT -Briefing of NATO countries -US commitment to NATO -Scope -Familiarity -Problems and benefits -Pragmatism -The President’s background -European discussions -European security conference -Rogers -Timing -Bilateral discussions -Benefits -Views -Italy Bull entered at an unknown time after 11:25 am. Rogers’s arrival Bull left at an unknown time before 12:02 pm. -Nicolae Ceausescu -Soviet intentions 24 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) -US view -Need for security -Germany -NATO -Defense budgets -Soviet aims -Germany -Loosening of Europe’s ties with US -MBFR -Timing -Linkage to European Security Conference -US caution -Agreement among allies -Brosio -Danger of linkage to European Security Conference -Cultural component -Agenda -Andrei A. Gromyko -Likelihood -Eastern Europeans -The President’s previous travles -Poles, Romanians, Hungarians, Czechoslovakians -Agenda -Possible benefits -Communication, trade, security -Germany -Italy -Brandt -Ostpolitik -Rogers -Gromyko -MBFR -Rogers -Gromyko -Search for formula -Dutch domestic situation -Multilateralism -NATO -Need for caution -Timing 25 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) Forthcoming European meeting on monetary matters -Timing -Possible location -The Hague -World Court -Europe’s relationship with Communist nations, Japan -Possible locations -Rivalries -London, Paris, Bonn, Rome -Brussels, Luxembourg, Strasbourg -The Hague -Belgium The President’s schedule -Biesheuvel -Schedule -PRC and Soviet Union trips State dinner, January 25, 1972 -Van Lynden -Rogers -The president’s Vietnam peace proposal speech, January 25, 1972 -Location -Oval Office -Preparation -Drafts -Idiom -Michael J. Mansfield -Rogers -Rogers -Talk with the President -Biesheuvel’s interest in television -Mass media impact on politics -Dutch cabinet sessions -Reporting -Interviews Dutch television -State involvement -Broadcasting companies 26 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF Tape Subject Log (rev. 10/06) Conv. No. 656-10 (cont.) Vietnam -The President’s peace proposal plan -Possible reaction in Europe -Elections -Thieu offer of resignation -International oversight -North Vietnamese reaction -Possible North Vietnamese military action -South Vietnam -US aid -North Vietnam -Analogy to North Korea -Peace proposal plan -US troop withdrawal -Political agreement -US aid to South Vietnam -Soviet and PRC aid to North Vietnam -Political agreement Biesheuvel’s schedule Briefcase The President, et al. left at 12:02 pm.