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Conversation: 479-003

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Start Date: Wednesday, April 14, 1971 3:30 PM

End Date: Wednesday, April 14, 1971 5:20 PM

Participants:

Nixon, Richard M. (President)Haldeman, H. R. ("Bob")Bull, Stephen B.Casey, William J.Casey, Sophia (Kurz)Casey, BernadetteCoffinas, GustavLangan, Thomas (Mrs.)Blen, MaryKurz, LillianShaheen, John M.Hall, Leonard W.Kirk, ConstanceVirdone, JosephDickey, Raymond R.Wells, John A.Frank, BenOwens, Hugh F.Smith, Richard B.Needham, James J.Needham, Dolores A. (Habick)Herlong, A[lbert] Sydney, Jr.Lasker, Bernard J. ("Bunny")Regan, Donald T.Morin, Charles F.Anderson, Glenn E.Gordon, Albert H.Calvert, Gordon L.Rohatyn, FelixMelton, Andrew J., Jr.Stans, Maurice H.Burns, Arthur F.Connally, John B.Springer, William L.Carter, RobertFolger, John C.Sirica, John J.Ryan, Michale B.Sanchez, ManoloMosbacher, Emil ("Bus"), Jr.

Recording Device: Oval Office

Full Tape Conversation Start Time: 01:12:08

Full Tape Conversation End Time: 02:51:10

479-003.mp3

NARA Description:

On April 14, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, Stephen B. Bull, William J. Casey, Sophia (Kurz) Casey, Bernadette Casey, Gustav Coffinas, Mrs. Thomas Langan, Mary Blen, Lillian Kurz, John M. Shaheen, Leonard W. Hall, Constance Kirk, Joseph Virdone, Raymond R. Dickey, John A. Wells, Ben Frank, Hugh F. Owens, Richard B. Smith, James J. Needham, Dolores A. (Habick) Needham, A[lbert] Sydney Herlong, Jr., Bernard J. ("Bunny") Lasker, Donald T. Regan, Charles F. Morin, Glenn E. Anderson, Albert H. Gordon, Gordon L. Calvert, Felix Rohatyn, Andrew J. Melton, Jr., Maurice H. Stans, Arthur F. Burns, John B. Connally, William L. Springer, Robert Carter, John C. Folger, John J. Sirica, Michale B. Ryan, Manolo Sanchez, and Emil ("Bus") Mosbacher, Jr. met in the Oval Office of the White House from 10:30 am to 12:20 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 479-003 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid:

Conversation No. 479-3

Date: April 14, 1971
Time: 10:30 am - 12:20 pm
Location: Oval Office

The President met with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman

     Anti-ballistic Missiles [ABM]
          -Vote
          -Administration’s position
                 -Staff meeting
          -Strategy
                 -Political price for votes
                 -Quid pro quo
                       -Contracts, judgeships
                 -Staff
                 -Necessity
                                16

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      -Trades
      -Timing of vote
      -Trades
-President’s possible meeting with Senators
      -Arguments
      -Administration losses in Senate
            -Illinois
      -Gains                                       Conv. No. 479-2 (cont.)
            -Margaret Chase Smith
            -William E. Brock, III
-President’s previous meeting
      -Henry A. Kissinger
-Administration’s position
-President’s instruction for staff
-President’s meeting with Senators
      -Timing
      -Melvin R. Laird
      -Cabinet
      -William B. Saxbe
      -Clark MacGregor and William E. Timmons
-Presidential involvement
      -Timing
      -Staff responsibilities
      -Firmness
      -Strategic Arms Limitation Talks [SALT]
            -William P. Rogers
            -Possible statement
-Arguments
-Deals
-President’s previous meeting
-Timing of vote
-President’s possible involvement
-Senators
      -David H. Gambrell
      -Lawton M. Chiles, Jr.
      -Arguments
      -Laird
            -Gambrell
      -Kissinger’s role
            -Gambrell
            -Chiles
                                       17

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                 -Lloyd M. Bentsen, Jr.
                 -Smith
           -Shifts
     -Nuclear Engine for Rocket Vehicle Application [NERVA]
     -Administration’s position
     -Timing of vote
           -Kissinger’s views
     -President’s previous meeting                              Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
           -Smith
           -Timing of vote
     -Timing
     -Administration’s advantages
           -Deals
           -Presidential involvement
     -Appropriations bill
           -Prospects in Senate

Texas drought
     -President’s conversation with General George A. Lincoln
     -John G. Tower
     -Publicity
     -John B. Connally
           -Involvement
     -Political handling
     -Haldeman’s forthcoming call to Tower
     -Political handling
           -Lincoln
           -President’s interest
     -Clifford M. Hardin
     -Presidential interest
           -Haldeman’s forthcoming call to Hardin
           -Publicity

Justice Department
      -Drugs
      -[J. Edgar Hoover?]
      -War on crime
      -John N. Mitchell
      -Richard A. Moore
                                       18

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President’s conversation with Kissinger
     -Kissinger’s dinner with Joseph W. Alsop
     -Marilyn B. (“Missy”) Chandler

President’s schedule
     -Meeting with Arthur F. Burns
           -Burns’ schedule
                 -Forthcoming trip                             Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
           -George P. Shultz
           -John D. Ehrlichman
           -Leonard Garment
           -Shultz
           -Paul W. McCracken
           -Quadriad
                 -Ehrlichman
           -Time
     -Forthcoming Republican Governors’ Conference, April 19, 1971
           -Mitchell’s views
           -Ehrlichman’s views
           -Revenue sharing
           -Welfare reform
                 -Ronald W. Reagan and Nelson A. Rockefeller
                 -Issue
                 -Poll
                       -Families with children
                       -Framing of questions
                       -Elliot L. Richardson
                 -Timing
                 -Ehrlichman
                 -Hard line
           -Timing
     -Daughters of the American Revolution [DAR]
           -Meeting
           -President’s participation
                 -Greetings
           -Marine Corps Band
                 -”Hail to the Chief”
           -Thelma C. (Ryan) (“Pat”) Nixon
                 -Schedule
           -Tricia Nixon
                 -Schedule
                                              19

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                                     Tape Subject Log
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         -Office press conference
         -Congressional leadership
         -Republican Governors’ Conference
               -Statement on welfare reform
               -Harry S. Dent
               -Opening
         -Worship service
               -Invitations                                     Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
               -Editors
               -List

    Smith
         -Approach toward Administration
         -Lieutenant William L. Calley, Jr.
              -Speech
         -Support for Administration

    President’s schedule


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    ZAMBIA


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         -Visit to Camp Pendleton
               -1st Marine Division
               -Visit by Moroccan King [Moulay] Hassan II
         -Visit to California
               -Timing
         -Chamber of Commerce
                                               20

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          -Visit by King Hassan II
                -Prime Minister Mohammed Karim Laurani
          -Visit to Camp Pendleton
                -Ceremony
                -Invitations
          -Meeting with Dr. Rainer Barzel [?]
                -Duration
                      -Previous meeting with Barzel            Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
          -Visit to California
                -Kissinger’s view
                -Timing
                -Demonstrations
                -Possible public perception
          -Camp David
          -White House
          -Visit to California
                -Kissinger’s view
                -Demonstrations
                -Timing
                -Press conference
                -Camp Pendleton
                      -Ceremony
          -Chamber of Commerce
          -Camp Pendleton
                -Moore
                -Welcome-home ceremony
                      -Ehrlichman
                      -John A. Scali
                -Timing
          -California
          -Florida

Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 10:30 am

          -Swearing-in ceremony for William J. Casey

Bull left at an unknown time before 11:10 am

     Tricia Nixon’s wedding
           -Invitations to White House staff and Cabinet
                 -Rose Mary Woods
                 -John S. Davies
                                   21

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      -McCracken
      -Kissinger
      -Woods
      -Casey
      -Dean Burch
      -Problem
            -Analogy
                  -Haldeman and Ehrlichman          Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
                  -Unknown ceremony
      -Ehrlichman’s views
      -Haldeman and Ehrlichman
      -Peter G. Peterson
      -Kissinger
      -Peterson
      -McCracken
      -Caspar W. (“Cap”) Weinberger
      -Haldeman, Ehrlichman, and Kissinger
      -Peter M. Flanigan
      -Assistants to the President
      -Scali
      -Charles W. Colson
      -Scali
      -Herbert G. Klein
      -Ronald L. Ziegler
      -Klein
      -Woods
      -Patrick J. Buchanan
      -Scali
      -Shelley A. Scarney
      -Garment
      -Buchanan-Scarney
            -Wedding
      -Raymond K. Price, Jr.
      -William L. Safire
      -Assistants to the President and Klein
-Number of invitations
-Limit
-Staff
      -Peterson
      -Flanigan
      -Klein
      -Kissinger
                                                 22

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                   -Haldeman
                   -Ehrlichman
                   -Peterson
             -Julie Nixon Eisenhower’s wedding

Bull entered at an unknown time after 10:30 am

     Casey swearing-in ceremony                                      Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
          -Statement
          -President’s position
          -John J. Sirica

Bull left at an unknown time before 11:10 am

     T. Nixon’s wedding

Casey, Sophia (Kurz) Casey, Bernadette Casey, George Casey, Mrs. Thomas Langan, Mrs. Fred
Nimmich, Mary Blend, Lillian Kurz, John M. Shaheen, Leonard W. Hall, Constance Kirk,
Joseph Virdone, Raymond R. Dickey, John A. Wells, Ben Frank, Hugh F. Owens, Richard B.
Smith, James J. Needham, Dolores A. (Habick) Needham, A[lbert] Sydney Herlong, Jr., Bernard
J. (“Bunny”) Lasker, Donald T. Regan, Charles F. Morin, Glenn E. Anderson, Albert H. Gordon,
Gordon L. Calvert, Felix Rohatyn, Andrew J. Melton, Jr., Maurice H. Stans, Burns, Connally,
William L. Springer, Robert Carter, John C. Folger, Sirica, and Michael B. Ryan entered at
11:10 am; members of the press were present at the beginning of the meeting

     [General conversation]

[Applause]

     Securities and Exchange Commission [SEC]
          -Office
          -Regulatory agencies
                 -Impact
                 -Business
          -W. J. Casey

[Applause]

     Swearing-in of W. J. Casey
         -Oath of office

[Applause]
                                               23

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                                            (rev. 9/08)



     Burns

     Ceremony
         -President’s confidence in W. J. Casey

     W. J. Casey’s statement
           -Gratitude
           -SEC                                                  Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
                -Administration’s policy
                -Tradition
                -Staff
                -Capitalist system
                -Investor confidence
                -Capital machinery
                -Capital resources
                -Importance
                -Economic health
                -US competitive position in world
                -Objectives
                -Cooperation with other agencies/Congress
                -Responsibility

[Applause]

     [General conversation]

     Presentation of Bible/gifts

     [General conversation]

     Unknown man’s collaboration with W. J. Casey

     [General conversation]
          -Relief rolls
          -Potomac fever

Bull entered at 11:26 am

     Gifts for W. J. Casey party
           -Tie clasp

Bull, W. J. Casey, et al. left at 11:26 am
                                             24

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Manolo Sanchez entered at an unknown time after 11:26 am

     Weather

Sanchez left at an unknown time before 11:30 am

     President’s schedule                                      Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
          -Trip to Florida
          -Agriculture dinner
          -Florida
                -Visit of Giuseppe Saragat
          -Trip to California
          -Agricultural dinner
                -Entertainment
          -Trip to Florida
                -Saragat visit
          -Trip to California
          -Dinner for King Hassan II
          -Camp David
          -Office press conference
          -Trip to California
          -Press conference
          -Photographers’ dinner
          -Press conference
          -California trip
                -Duration
          -Correspondents’ dinner
          -Church service
          -Correspondents’ dinner
                -Publishers & editors
          -Church service
          -Marines
                -1st Marine Division
                -Calley
                -Timing
                -Kissinger
          -Announcement
          -California trip
                -Western White House
          -Vacation
                -California
                                              25

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                -August
                -Congress
          -California
                -Bohemian Grove
          -Arts and sciences
          -Republican Governors’ Conference
                -”Bull” session
                -Timing                                        Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
                -Topics of conversation
                      -Dent
                      -Mitchell
                      -Robert H. Finch
                      -Thomas W. Evans
                      -Robert J. Dole
                      -Franklyn C. (“Lyn”) Nofziger

     Appointments
         -W. J. Casey
         -Charles W. Yost
         -Recommendations
              -Kissinger
              -Shultz
         -Dismissals
              -Alain C. Enthoven
                    -McGeorge Bundy
                    -Shultz
                    -1972 election campaign

     President’s schedule
          -Meeting with Barzel

     Cabinet and staff
          -Connally’s view
          -John A. Volpe
          -Passion

Bull entered at an unknown time after 11:26 am

     President’s schedule
          -Meeting with Barzel
                -Rolf Pauls
                -Kissinger
                                               26

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Bull left at an unknown time before 11:44 am

     Cabinet and staff
          -Commitment to President’s policies
               -Daniel P. (“Pat”) Moynihan
               -Lack of passion
               -Ehrlichman and Shultz                            Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
               -Ziegler
               -Klein
               -Reflection upon the President
               -Garment’s theory
               -Connally’s view
                      -Texas drought
                      -Lincoln
               -Statistics
               -Lack of warmth/passion
               -Speech writing
                      -Noel C. Koch
               -Vice President Spiro T. Agnew
               -Need for warmth/commitment
               -Procedures
                      -John K. Andrews, Jr.
          -John F. Kennedy
               -Victor Lasky’s Man & the Myth
               -Publicity
               -Garment’s opinion

Kissinger entered at an unknown time after 11:26 am

     President’s schedule
          -Barzel meeting

Kissinger left at an unknown time before 11:44 am

     Cabinet and staff
          -Commitment to President’s policies
               -Need for warmth
               -Price
               -Letter from unknown person in Florida
               -Public statement by the President
                      -Press conferences and conversations
                                              27

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                -Connally’s view
                -Need for emotion
                -Peterson, Kissinger, Ehrlichman, et al.
                -Connally’s view
                      -Lyndon B. Johnson
                            -Style compared with the President
                -Ehrlichman, Shultz, Kissinger, Mitchell, Donald H. Rumsfeld, and Garment
                -Instructions for Haldeman                               Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
                -Illusion
                      -Press conferences and conversations
                -President’s image
                      -Television
                      -Demonstrators
                -Connally’s view
                -Price, Safire, Moore, Klein, Ziegler, Scali, and Colson
                -Instructions for Haldeman
                -Public relations
                -Press conferences
          -President’s image
                -Press conferences
                -Need for evaluation
                -Kennedy’s image
                -Rumsfeld’s possible view
                      -McCracken
                      -President’s credibility
                -Style
                -Moore, Price, Garment, and Safire
                -Klein
                -Scali
                -Ziegler, Shultz, and Kissinger
          -Commitment to President’s policies
                -Connally’s view
                      -Passion
          -Apathy, efficiency, lack of warmth
          -Rogers
                -Schedule
                -Connally
                -Views

Bull entered at an unknown time after 11:26 am

     President’s schedule
                                               28

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          -Meeting with Burns

Bull left at an unknown time before 11:44 am
      President’s image

Kissinger entered at 11:44 am

     Barzel meeting                                                   Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)

Haldeman left at 11:44 am

          -Barzel
                -Minority leader of parliament
                -Chancellor candidate
                -Christian Democratic Union [CDU]
          -Kurt Georg Kiesinger
          -Points of discussion
                -Berlin
                      -Presence of Federal Republic of Germany [FRG]
                      -Andrei A. Gromyko
                -Access routes to Berlin
                      -Sovereignty of East Germany [German Democratic Republic [GDR]]
          -CDU
                -Possible vote on negotiations
          -US/Union of Soviet Socialist Republics [USSR] negotiations
          -Berlin
                -Access routes
                -GDR
                -Presence of FRG
          -Points of discussion
          -Interpreter
          -Duration
          -President’s schedule
                -Meeting with Burns

     Article on People’s Republic of China [PRC]
           -Haldeman
           -Henry Hubbard

Barzel, Emil (“Bus”) Mosbacher, Jr., and Pauls entered at 11:47 am; the White House
photographer and members of the press were present at the beginning of the meeting
                                       29

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[General conversation]

Photo session
[General conversation]
     -Weather

Berlin
     -Importance                                                Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
     -US position
     -Statements to Pauls
     -President’s conversation with Gromyko
     -[Talking points]
           -FRG’s presence
           -Access routes
                 -GDR sovereignty
                 -Negotiations
                 -GDR sovereignty
     -Negotiations
     -President’s meetings with FRG leaders
           -Willy Brandt
     -Gromyko
     -FRG’s presence
     -Sovereignty over access routes
           -GDR
     -Negotiations
     -Technical issues
     -President’s conversation with Gromyko
     -FRG presence
     -Sovereignty
     -Treaty draft
     -US position
     -Four-power responsibility
     -Technical issues
     -Points of discussion
     -Barzel’s September 1970 meeting with the President
     -FRG’s position
     -Barzel’s possible public statement
     -Domestic/foreign policy considerations
     -Soviet position
           -Lack of concessions
     -CDU/Christian Socialist Union [CSU] position regarding Soviet treaties
           -Vote in Bundestag
                                  30

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-President’s Congressional message [Second annual report to Congress on US foreign
      policy, February 25, 1971]
-Effect on Berlin people
      -Prevent mass departure from city
-Young workers
-Links with FRG
-US/North Atlantic Treaty Organization [NATO]
      -Democracy                                            Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
-Question of FRG presence
      -Administrative presence
      -Parliamentary controls
            -Committees
            -Group meetings
-President’s statements on FRG presence and access rights
-Four powers
-Possible Soviet rights over three western sectors
      -Four powers
      -Impact on democracy
-Seriousness of issues
-Modus vivendi with USSR
      -Practical matters
            -Kissinger
-Lack of settlement
-Soviet views regarding Brandt’s Ostpolitik
-FRG/Soviet differences in point of view
      -Finality versus lack of settlement
      -CDU’s position
-Leonid I. Brezhnev’s statement
      -Common concerns of Western world
-Skepticism
      -Soviet intentions
-Issue
-Soviet intentions
      -Modus vivendi
-Possible FRG concerns
-Kissinger’s relations with [David] Kenneth Rush
-Impact of problem
      -German people
      -CDU
-Desire
      -Viable Berlin
      -Lessening of tensions
                                        31

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     -Dangers
           -Treaty with USSR
           -Berlin
     -US policy regarding Soviet/FRG treaty
     -US position regarding Berlin
           -Principles
     -Ambassador [Rush]
           -Brandt                                              Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
     -President’s conversation with Gromyko

Germany
    -FRG public opinion regarding USSR
    -Evaluation
    -Anti-communism
    -Disappointments
    -Brandt’s Ostpolitik
          -Results
    -Possible consequences of failure on Berlin issue
          -Nationalism
          -FRG foreign policy issues
                 -Nationalism
    -President’s second annual report to Congress on US foreign policy
    -Progress on German question
          -Connection to lessening of tension in Europe
    -Modus vivendi with GDR
    -Ostpolitik
          -German question
          -FRG government
                 -Temporary arrangement
          -USSR
                 -Permanent arrangement
          -FRG domestic politics
    -Dangers
    -Economic situation
    -Political situation
          -State elections, or Landtag
                 -CDU
    -European policy field
    -Summary of general mood
                                              32

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     Marxism
         -Appeal
               -Moscow and East Berlin
                     -Karl Marx
               -FRG and Catholic theologians
                     -Renaissance
         -Latin America
         -Intellectuals                                        Conv. No. 479-3 (cont.)
         -Workers

     Barzel’s visit
          -Candor
          -President’s conversation with Kissinger

     Kissinger
          -Possible visit to US

     Foreign visitors
          -Visits from governments and opposition
          -Great Britain
                 -Harold Wilson
          -France
          -Italy
          -Germans/British
          -Japan
                 -Socialists
                 -Prime Minister [Eisaku Sato]

     Berlin
          -Status

     Farewells
          -President’s greeting to Barzel’s colleagues
          -President’s foreign policy views
                -Kissinger

Kissinger, Barzel, Mosbacher, and Pauls left at 12:20 pm
                                               33

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